PO-INT OCT12

Bruce Wallace
Kishore Mahbubani
ENTRETIEN
Q&A
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Beyond China: A leading Asian
thinker says Canada needs a
diversified portfolio in Asia
Kishore Mahbubani was twice Singapore’s ambassador to the United Nations, but he is best known
as a leading evangelist for what he sees as the coming Asian century. In books and speeches around
the world, Mahbubani argues that Western global domination has been a historical aberration,
and that economic and political power is returning to its natural home in Asia. Mahbubani was a
philosophy student at Dalhousie University in the 1970s and he was Singapore’s high commissioner
to Canada for 10 years, so he has particular insight into Canada’s underwhelming performance in
Asia in recent years. While in Ottawa recently to speak to the Canadian Council of Chief Executives’
conference “Canada in the Pacific Century,” Mahbubani sat down with Policy Options editor Bruce
Wallace to remind Canadians that there is more to Asia than just China. He suggests the best way to
raise the Canadian profile is by concluding trade agreements and building personal relationships in
the Association of Southeast Asian Nations (ASEAN) countries.
Kishore Mahbubani a été deux fois ambassadeur de Singapour aux Nations Unies, mais il est
surtout connu dans le monde pour être le fervent défenseur de ce qui sera à ses yeux le siècle de
l’Asie. Dans ses livres et discours, il affirme que la domination de l’Occident a été une aberration
historique et que le pouvoir économique et politique retourne maintenant dans son habitat
naturel asiatique. Étudiant en philosophie à l’Université Dalhousie dans les années 1970 et hautcommissaire de Singapour au Canada pendant 10 ans, il a constaté de visu la faible performance
canadienne des dernières années en Asie. De passage à Ottawa pour prendre la parole à la
conférence « Le Canada à l’ère du Pacifique » du Conseil canadien des chefs d’entreprise, Kishore
Mahbubani s’est entretenu avec Bruce Wallace, le rédacteur en chef d’Options politiques. L’Asie
ne se limite pas à la Chine, a-t-il expliqué, et le meilleur moyen pour le Canada d’y accroître sa
visibilité est de conclure des accords commerciaux tout en tissant des liens étroits avec les pays de
l’ANASE (Association des Nations de l’Asie du Sud-Est).
Policy Options: What does
Canada look like when viewed
from Asia? Are Asians even
aware of Canada?
Kishore Mahbubani: Overall the view
of Canada is very positive in Asia. Canada is seen as a lucky country, full of
resources, with very few people. Many
Asians still want to migrate to Canada.
Many would love to have a passport. So
the overall image of Canada in Asia is a
very benign one.
But there is also an awareness that
Canada has neglected Asia. Canada has
paid very little attention. Let me give
you an example from Singapore. Singapore proposed a free trade agreement
with Canada and we thought we’d conclude with Canada first before going to
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OPTIONS POLITIQUES
OCTOBRE 2012
the United States. Well, the United States
came afterward, and we finished with
the United States, and we still haven’t
finished with Canada. So the sense I
have is that Canada really hasn’t made
much of a serious effort to engage Asia
in recent years. That’s been one of Canada’s biggest foreign policy mistakes.
PO: Asian countries are forming
regional organizations and building a regional infrastructure.
But now that Canada wants in,
it finds that it can’t get a seat at
those tables. How does it overcome this exclusion?
Kishore Mahbubani: Canada could
have got in. Take, for example, ASEAN.
ASEAN has signed free trade agreements
with China, South Korea, Japan, India,
Australia, New Zealand. And what’s the
country that’s missing? Canada. The
first thing Canada should do is propose
a free trade agreement with ASEAN. If
we can sign with all those countries,
surely we can sign one with Canada too.
That’s the easiest way to engage the
ASEAN countries. Once Canada becomes
more deeply engaged with the ASEAN
countries, there will be economic opportunities but also networking opportunities. In Asia, personal connections are
very important. You don’t just do business in a transactional way. It’s not the
letter of the contract that’s as important
as the personal relationships. And by
having a free trade agreement, that’s one
way of engaging ASEAN in Asia.
with Kishore Mahbubani
Q&A
can learn from the United States and
hedge its bets in the region. Just as it
has discovered the folly of selling 100
percent of its oil to the United States,
Canada should have a diversified portfolio in Asia.
PO: We always talk about exporting our energy to China.
But Japan has always lacked
indigenous energy resources,
and it has now shuttered much
of its nuclear energy industry in
wake of the Fukushima disaster.
Japan is an enormous economy
with a big imported energy
appetite. Is it an overlooked
opportunity for Canada?
Keeping the lights on in Tokyo: Japan’s
energy thirst is an opportunity for Canada.
PHOTO: CP PHOTO
PO: When Canadians talk about
Asia, too often what they are
talking about is China, while
other countries are mentioned
only tangentially. What are the
big opportunities in Asia outside of China?
Kishore Mahbubani: Clearly China is a
big part of the Asian story but it’s not the
only part of the Asian story. India is another big story and in fact there is a lot
of goodwill in India toward Canada too.
ASEAN has 600 million people. People
don’t realize that. It has some of the
fastest-growing economies. Indonesia is
doing remarkably well. The Indonesian
GNP will become bigger than the Canadian GNP very soon. Asia has got 3.5
billion people and China makes up less
than one-third of that. That’s why you
can’t look at China alone.
PO: Do Asians see our new
interest as opportunistic? Is
Canada’s approach to Asia too
trade focused?
Kishore Mahbubani: It wasn’t always.
I remember going back to Trudeau’s
time, Canada was focused on development and helping the Asian countries
and inviting Asian students to study in
Canadian universities. But the paradox
here is that the time when Asia began
to rise and began to do very well,
that’s the time that Canada started
paying less and less attention to Asia.
Canada should be reaping dividends.
PO: So how can Canada build
those relations? The Americans have rebuilt their relationship with Indonesia on
military-to-military links beginning with their humanitarian
relief after the tsunami. What’s
the Canadian way in?
Kishore Mahbubani: The American
rediscovery of Indonesia was driven by
geopolitical factors. After 9/11, when
suddenly America realized it needed
to find moderate Muslim friends,
it discovered that the world’s most
populous Islamic country is Indonesia.
That’s when the United States began
to back away from those old embargos
on Indonesia.
And when they finally woke up to
China and were looking for countries
to balance China, Indonesia became
even more attractive geopolitically. The
United States swung to ASEAN to balance China.
Canada is not a geopolitical player
in the way the United States is. But it
Kishore Mahbubani: I certainly
think so. There’s a natural partnership because Japan has got no natural
resources but a lot of technology and
a big domestic market. So Canada
should look to Japan as a natural
partner. In Japan there is also some
natural good will toward Canada,
probably because of the old G7 ties.
PO: So what would Asia like to
see from Canada? How do we
get their attention?
Kishore Mahbubani: Number one,
Canada should do something that
is a big bang. And a Canada-ASEAN
free trade agreement would be a big
bang event. It would suddenly wake
up everybody that Canada is coming
back, in a big way. Two, you should do
more people-to-people engagement,
try to provide more scholarships for,
let’s say, ASEAN students to come
study in Canada. That’s a very cheap
investment with a long-term payoff.
Look at Singapore, where some of the
ministers and permanent secretaries
were trained in Canadian universities
thanks to Canadian scholarships.
That’s a rich payoff for Canada.
In terms of priorities, Canada
should ask where it can benefit the
most from long-term engagement.
And if the 21st century is going to be
the Asian century, and I’m confident
that it’s going to be the Asian century,
then invest in Asia. ■
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OCTOBER 2012
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